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 [Theory & Debate] Who is Rose Quartz?

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PostSubject: [Theory & Debate] Who is Rose Quartz?   Fri May 13, 2016 8:25 am

So, I'm still holding onto the idea that Rose Quartz is Pink Diamond. I don't think she's just a plain ol' quartz that went astray. I don't think she was working for Pink Diamond - she IS Pink Diamond. I mean, if you look at the original diamond authority symbol, you see pink diamond on the bottom, representing where her gem is located; her stomach.





Then, you have Steven. Why would we be watching a show about a plain old quartz? We're not. We're watching a show where he is developing extraordinary abilities that are surpassing that of his mother because he is a human hybrid. He has powers that are unfamiliar to the gems - and they're pretty knowledgable about other gems and how gems operate. I don't think ordinary gems share these powers that Steven has. If they did, we wouldn't really be watching a show about him and he wouldn't be very special beyond being a human hybrid.

Plus, also note that Pearl's space suit has a pink diamond on it. We KNOW Pearl is 100000% loyal to Rose Quartz. I highly DOUBT she'd wear anybody else's insignia. It just, wouldn't happen.






Now, I will admit that Peridot does call Steven a quartz, but to be fair, she doesn't know anything about him. She believes Steven came from a Kindergarten. It's also possible that society has completely wiped Pink Diamond out of the picture of their history that Peridot doesn't even KNOW there was once a Pink Diamond. We only see murals with Yellow Diamond, Blue Diamond, and White Diamond (and we haven't even seen White Diamond yet) and that's all she addresses. Any other glimpses of Pink Diamond are wiped out.

Spoiler:
 

Jasper calls Rose Quartz by this title and not by Pink Diamond. Why on earth would Jasper call Rose Quartz Pink Diamond? She says she respects Rose's military tactics. Nothing more. She despises Rose Quartz. So calling her such a high title just wouldn't happen. She'd spit on Rose before that happened.

Finally comes the question: Is Rose Quartz good? Or, what kind of good is she? She's good to an extent because she wanted to save the Earth from gem destruction and she found beauty in all life. But, I don't think she's Steven-good or Usagi/Sailor Moon good. I think she's more Chaotic Good. There's rumours floating around out there that Rose was part of the gem fusion experiments. BUT she was only part of them because she wanted to try and save the gems that had fallen somehow so they would not have died in vain. She loved those gems after all. But the fact that there is this idea that Rose Quartz took part of these experiments casts a darker light on her. That and Jasper respects her military tactics. That also casts a shadow on Rose. She doesn't want Greg knowing anything really about her past and her eyes are often closed when we see her, meaning she's hiding something.


Last edited by Rose Quartz on Fri Jun 10, 2016 11:53 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: [Theory & Debate] Who is Rose Quartz?   Thu May 26, 2016 10:52 am

Goldenevil91 wrote:
I think shadow over her eyes  gives that away too. In anime it's a sign of somebody having dark secret or intentions or emotions charters go through.  And we know she had a lot of secrets.

I think we saw Rose without shadow over her eyes only three times. On the photo with Greg, on her portrait and in few moments during song "what can I do for you". Rose probably had a lot on her conscience. And I'm sure more then few sins too. However there is an other red flag here. We once see Rose with here eyes hidden. Unlike with Sapphire for Rose covered eyes aren't part of her character design.



Look at Rose's body language and expression on her face. When you compare it to tops from anime or mange this type of positioning one character over other one isn't a good sign.  It' rather a bad one suggesting not so nice intentions for other character in this case Steven.

And Steven's line in this part is creepy too!

"I will fight to be everything, that everybody wants me to be when I’m grown!"

Noticed he do not want to grow to expectations of those around him. But to be what they want him to be. This is bad since as a person you less and less make choices on your own or that would be good for you and others around you. Sometimes what you want isn't what you need.


Quoting it here for sake of conversation. But yeah I think we will yet to se who Rose really was and what were here reasons to make Steven half gem and half human.
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PostSubject: Re: [Theory & Debate] Who is Rose Quartz?   Sat May 28, 2016 9:30 am

Expanding more on Rose being chaotic good. We know she's not evil otherwise there'd be no Earth left in this universe and no story. However, she's not angelic like Pearl makes her out to be.

It's interesting that we see her as NOT angelic from Greg's point of view - he was her romantic/sexual partner after all. You'd think he'd look at her the same way Pearl does or almost the same way.

I think she's made mistakes that we'd consider sinister. I think originally, she was on board with dominating the Earth for gemkind but then somehow, she realized it was a mistake. I also think with her fallen comrades, she made mistakes with them as well. Not protecting everyone, only her close friends, not being able to heal them, etc. It's part of why I can get on board with Rose Quartz having done her own personal experiments with "forced fusion", only tried to look at it from a different light.

We learned from Gem Drill that gem shards just want to be whole, right? Well, perhaps Rose not being able to heal her friends and allies decided to take new approaches, desperate to make amends and help her friends and allies somehow, some way. Here's where we can get her attempts at forced fusion. She wanted to make them whole again. She realized this was causing more harm than good, so she stopped. All of this of course was done in secret - that's why Garnet didn't have a clue and even said "Rose couldn't have known!" Rose kept her secrets.

Rose Quartz I think adds a very interesting layer to the question of "what does it mean to be good?".

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PostSubject: Re: [Theory & Debate] Who is Rose Quartz?   Sat May 28, 2016 9:51 am

Rose reminds me in a lot of ways of an anti hero.

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PostSubject: Re: [Theory & Debate] Who is Rose Quartz?   Sat May 28, 2016 9:58 am

Addelyn wrote:
Rose reminds me in a lot of ways of an anti hero.

Do share more - I'm curious of your thoughts Grin Strawberry

Because most of the time, when a character is an "anti-hero", they're usually portrayed as a seemingly rude, uncaring character, doing things for their own gain.

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PostSubject: Re: [Theory & Debate] Who is Rose Quartz?   Sun May 29, 2016 9:21 am

Sure, there are lots of anti-hero's who fit that mold, but a antihero is a protagonist who lacks conventional heroic qualities such as idealism, courage or morality.

We know that Rose Quartz has ideals and she fights for them. What I'm questioning is her morality.

Even by the time she meets Greg, after being on Earth for THOUSANDS of years she still doesn't really understands the being on the planet. It's almost as if she views humans as really small playthings, or not really sentient in the same way that Crystals are. She still views Crystals as superior.

Sure, she may have taken a liking to the planet and wanted to save it, but she has a lot of secrets. We don't know what she was doing to the Bubbled gems, or what's up with Lion.

I call her an anti-hero cause while she wants to save Earth, it may not be for the same reasons that Garnet, Amethyst and Pearl do. They're the ones that have learned about this planet and love it and the humans. they have taken time to get to know them, more so than I think Rose ever did.

She may have saved Earth, but I think its for her own reasons rather than for the creatures on that planet.

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PostSubject: Re: [Theory & Debate] Who is Rose Quartz?   Sun May 29, 2016 11:57 am

Addelyn wrote:
Sure, there are lots of anti-hero's who fit that mold, but a antihero is a protagonist who lacks conventional heroic qualities such as idealism, courage or morality.

We know that Rose Quartz has ideals and she fights for them. What I'm questioning is her morality.

Even by the time she meets Greg, after being on Earth for THOUSANDS of years she still doesn't really understands the being on the planet. It's almost as if she views humans as really small playthings, or not really sentient in the same way that Crystals are. She still views Crystals as superior.

Yeeeeeessss. Yesyesyes. This right here. I've always wondered about this. This war for Earth was over 5000 years ago but she still doesn't get humans? She didn't get them beforehand? Are humans just cute little pets? Or what if she had some other sort of motive...

Addelyn wrote:
Sure, she may have taken a liking to the planet and wanted to save it, but she has a lot of secrets. We don't know what she was doing to the Bubbled gems, or what's up with Lion.

Yep. Especially when Peridot first saw the bubbled gems. Her first thought was "Oh my stars. You're going to HARVEST ME?!?!" Which. What does that even mean? scratch

Addelyn wrote:
I call her an anti-hero cause while she wants to save Earth, it may not be for the same reasons that Garnet, Amethyst and Pearl do. They're the ones that have learned about this planet and love it and the humans. they have taken time to get to know them, more so than I think Rose ever did.

She may have saved Earth, but I think its for her own reasons rather than for the creatures on that planet.

But the question becomes, what is her reason?

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PostSubject: Re: [Theory & Debate] Who is Rose Quartz?   Sun May 29, 2016 12:57 pm

Do you think her wanting to becoming pregnant with Steven in order to create a life form between her and Greg may have changed her in the last parts of her life? Like we see all this of her not quite understanding humans, but it seems she also learned so much and maybe started to be on the same level as the other Crystal Gems of understanding and loving humans, thanks to Greg. It kind of makes me wish we could see more of their relationship and her development. I don't think she's as anti-hero or bad as some of you are making her out to be, she's just imperfect like everyone else. Besides, how would she end up being the villain over all if Steven has her gem anyway. I'm sure there are some dark secrets that we don't know yet of her and I'm sure it will make Steven question his mom and the gems at some point but I'm not so sure if it will be quite as bad as what we are thinking.
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PostSubject: Re: [Theory & Debate] Who is Rose Quartz?   Sun May 29, 2016 1:06 pm

Brit-chan wrote:
Do you think her wanting to becoming pregnant with Steven in order to create a life form between her and Greg may have changed her in the last parts of her life? Like we see all this of her not quite understanding humans, but it seems she also learned so much and maybe started to be on the same level as the other Crystal Gems of understanding and loving humans, thanks to Greg. It kind of makes me wish we could see more of their relationship and her development. I don't think she's as anti-hero or bad as some of you are making her out to be, she's just imperfect like everyone else. Besides, how would she end up being the villain over all if Steven has her gem anyway. I'm sure there are some dark secrets that we don't know yet of her and I'm sure it will make Steven question his mom and the gems at some point but I'm not so sure if it will be quite as bad as what we are thinking.

Well that's why I say she's chaotic good rather than like, lawful good like Steven leans towards.

Rose paints herself a bit negatively because she thinks humans are "funny" and "entertaining" (looking at you, What Can I Do? song).

I will admit, in the episode where Greg tells Rose to just, talk to him, I think Rose learns a lot. I think she definitely changed from that point all the way to where she's pregnant. I mean, the home video of her seems so...wonderful, like she's a wonderful person/gem. But up until that point, what was her motive to protect humans? Funny, entertainment? She didn't get such a change til 5000 years later.

Though for the longest time, I thought they were actually lying to Steven (I still sort of think so). I don't think the war happened 5000 years ago. I think it was much more recent.

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PostSubject: Re: [Theory & Debate] Who is Rose Quartz?   Sun May 29, 2016 3:39 pm

Yes especially when Greg said that Steven don't know what is like in the return episode. Greg's reaction was waaay too emotional to know stuff about gem war for Earth just from stories from Rose.
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PostSubject: Re: [Theory & Debate] Who is Rose Quartz?   Sun May 29, 2016 10:58 pm

I think she did change after getting to know Greg but I can't help but wonder if Steven is just a giant experiment for her. Why would a Gem, knowing that they both can't exist, have a human-gem child? And another thing, how does she know that she and Steven can't exist at the same time?

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PostSubject: Re: [Theory & Debate] Who is Rose Quartz?   Mon May 30, 2016 12:08 am

Maybe she wanted to make Greg happy by doing the thing that makes humans happy, forming a family?
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PostSubject: Re: [Theory & Debate] Who is Rose Quartz?   Mon May 30, 2016 7:14 am

I'm sure Greg would have been happy just with her sans-serif kids.

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PostSubject: Re: [Theory & Debate] Who is Rose Quartz?   Mon May 30, 2016 2:07 pm

And I heard that Rose could just give birth to Steven but he would be just a human and not a half gem. I'm telling ya Rose had huge plans involving Steven and who he would be for this world...or shall I say Universe :afro: ?
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PostSubject: Re: [Theory & Debate] Who is Rose Quartz?   Mon May 30, 2016 3:03 pm

Sardonyx wrote:
I'm sure Greg would have been happy just with her sans-serif kids.

I'm sure he would but maybe its what she wanted to give to him? Who knows. They could never fuse in the way that gems do but she wanted to be able to somehow do something similar (we all know what fusion equates to for humans so...>.>). We don't really know her desires exactly but it seems she really did love Greg, enough to want to bear a child even though I don't even know how exactly that would have worked as her physical form isn't really human? But...thats probably a whole other discussion...

Goldenevil91 wrote:
And I heard that Rose could just give birth to Steven but he would be just a human and not a half gem. I'm telling ya Rose had huge plans involving Steven and who he would be for this world...or shall I say Universe  :afro: ?

Where did you hear this? Just curious xD
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PostSubject: Re: [Theory & Debate] Who is Rose Quartz?   Mon May 30, 2016 5:28 pm

In many reviews theories and I think somebody said crewverse siad so as well
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PostSubject: Re: [Theory & Debate] Who is Rose Quartz?   Mon May 30, 2016 8:12 pm

Links tho? >.> Cause i'm clueless on following crewniverse stuff and reading up in this fandom
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PostSubject: Re: [Theory & Debate] Who is Rose Quartz?   Tue May 31, 2016 3:59 pm

Dude I saw it mostly on tumblr ...It will taje ages to find this :c or if I get my guide maybe I will find evidence for it
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PostSubject: Re: [Theory & Debate] Who is Rose Quartz?   Tue May 31, 2016 6:00 pm

Aaah okay, I was just wondering cause I wantd to read up on it xD if you can't find them then ah well!
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PostSubject: Re: [Theory & Debate] Who is Rose Quartz?   Wed Jun 01, 2016 7:05 am

We will have to take this with a grain of salt on whether or not Steven could have existed without her gem. It cannot be confirmed anywhere so it's as good as fanon.

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PostSubject: Re: [Theory & Debate] Who is Rose Quartz?   Wed Jun 01, 2016 11:18 am

It's not just her gem but why can only 1 of them exist? Are they not able to share it?

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PostSubject: Re: [Theory & Debate] Who is Rose Quartz?   Wed Jun 01, 2016 3:18 pm

I don't think Rose could split her gemstone in half and just give it to Steven...still it is interesting why they both couldn't exist and how Rose knew it ? There wasn't anything like Steven before
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PostSubject: Re: [Theory & Debate] Who is Rose Quartz?   Wed Jun 01, 2016 3:30 pm

Goldenevil91 wrote:
I don't think Rose could split her gemstone in half and just give it to Steven...still it is interesting why they both couldn't exist and how Rose knew it ? There wasn't anything like Steven before

Well, it makes sense. Steven got her stone - literally. He didn't grow his own. How can she exist with her own gem and Steven have the same gem?

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PostSubject: Re: [Theory & Debate] Who is Rose Quartz?   Sat Jun 04, 2016 8:57 am

She could not. The only way she would exist and Steven would be him being born as human only with no gem.
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PostSubject: Re: [Theory & Debate] Who is Rose Quartz?   Sat Jun 04, 2016 11:03 am

How would she know that Steven would have a gem at all? I think I remember (and please correct me if I'm wrong!) that the Gems at points in time on Earth split up and kind of did their own thing (at least until it looks like they found Amethyst) so I wonder if during that time, Rose did some experiments and that's how she knew. 

Poor Greg thought its like oh baby I"m pregnant (Happy Greg) but when the baby is born I will cease to exist (disheartened, heart broken, depressed Greg). This makes me wonder thought if he ever thought about you know, stopping the pregnancy via abortion or whatever or ever regretted Steven. Thoughts for another thread I suppose.

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